51 thoughts on “michael loyd young – mongolia”

  6. pair of eyes

    Many of us who are photographers simply don’t have the verbal dexterity of a JOE or a DAH or a BOB BLACK to talk about the poetry of an image — this one works for a lot of reasons — you all know that — motion, drama, energy, narrative… The power of photography is often in its intrinsic language — sometimes we here are carried away saying what does or doesn’t work, and why.

    I note on his website (btw THANKS Ed. for posting the link !!! But next time, have it as a POP-OFF window so the readers don’t leave Burn) that Michael gives all the proceeds from his photography to Alzheimers research. That’s extraordinary.

    I can’t even ride a horse; Michael drives his steed AND shoots. And well, I might add.

    P.O.E.

  8. Sidney Atkins

    Great photo, Michael. Yes, this is ‘my kind’ of photography… in addition to being aesthetically beautiful and an action shot that captures a ‘moment’ it also shows me the terrain, the weather, the season, people engaged in work or livelihood, and something about local technology… (and besides the landscape is one I personally identify with)… and so I wonder if this is as good a time as any to bring up DAH’s occasional use of the word “didactic” in describing certain kinds of documentary photography… sometimes I think I know what he means by that, and sometimes I’m not sure, and it’s a word I have mixed feelings about but it seems to be part of the dialogue about photography… So, David, would you describe this as a “didactic” photo or not? And why or why not?

  10. bobblack

    ”

    “What he loved in horses was what he loved in men, the blood and the heat of the blood that ran them.” All The Pretty Horses, Cormac Mccarthy

    wonderful and gorgeous photograph. I love this white-soul in the middle of a land of umber, like a beacon, a pulpy full-of-light light and its full-on gaze straight into the heart of the photograher…and me, the viewer….all that huge silence, like a slumpering god, and this brilliant white bolt of life striding toward us…that’s it, that’s the life lived and all the energy contained therein…

    a wonderful and powerful moment and full of tilting and gathering….

    love the vitality and the eternity and above all, the intense life-filled joy in this photograph…

    thanks for sharing!

    running
    bob

    \

  11. Lassal

    Amazing picture …

    I just would have loved to see more faces… or eyes … of horses and men. And I am really curious about the picture that would have been a split second later from this one. The white horse would have been more towards us, the brown to the left more to the left, the left guy a little more in the center, the horses on the right would be running out of the frame. If one at that point were a little closer or little more to the right to crop the brown horse left and maybe on a horse right too, having the white one getting really close…. See what I mean? It would have been much more dynamic I think. Now it is all neatly inside of the frame… even forming some kind of circle … It is great, but I think the later moment could have given more of the dynamic.
    Please … Michael … I know how hard this is to get. and maybe you have this later second I am talking about and it is not good at all… :)))

    I just think it would be better if you were even closer. More inside. Or a little later. Just curious.

  12. Mike Halminski

    It looks like any closer would be dangerously close. There’s some fast, powerful action here. I like the earthy colors, although a bit contrasty, like transparency film.
    I was wondering if this was a personal project or an assignment? How did you get to be accepted by the horsemen for them to let you get in on the action?

  13. ben

    when i applied to go to photography school, i turned up with a portfolio that consisted of images from 22 months travelling around the world – the bulk of which was from 2 months through china/tibet and south east asia.

    i was pretty proud of this work at the time – some “beautiful” images.

    i put them in front of the photographers/lecturers who were to decide whether or not to approve my application, and watched as they flipped through the prints.

    the first comment? “nice photographs, but then how could you not get nice photographs when you’ve been to such beautiful places?”

    i’d never thought of this before, but its stayed with me; i’m going to throw a few questions out there, a challenge even: there’s no doubt that this is a beautiful photograph – an amazing landscape, dynamic horses, the golden pallete.

    my question – is this enough? is it enough for another guy from the affluent west to go to tibet or mongolia and take some beautiful photographs of horses and their owners?

    i’d hope that this can be seen as a wider question than just about this image – i just feel like there are some visual journeys that seem to be visited again and again by countless photographers whose (beautiful) imagery merges into one. when i think about the truly memorable bodies of work that i looked at last year, i think of the more unique personal visions – for instance Lars Tunbjorks “Vinter”, and Trent Parke’s “Christmas Tree” that was widely discussed here on Burn.

    Should we as photographers travel the well worn path (both in location and in the way we tell stories) or be looking for more original/unique ways of telling stories?

  14. Byron

    I love how at ease the rider with the pole seems. Its an insane moment yet there is simplicity and experience in his movement. There is a really interesting comparison of man and beast here. The white horse is a message all his own, about beauty and light, and about standing out.

  16. Lassal

    Ben, I think you really have got a point here. And DAH has alredy tried to get us to think about this in the past.

    Maybe it would be a good topic for a completely new round of discussions here … or maybe even under “dialogue”?

  17. Byron

    Ben, I also agree, while I really like this shot, it does bring up those questions. For Michael maybe his choice of beautiful locations might have something to do with that one of the most meaningful parts of his work is that he donates all proceeds to Alzheimers research. So maybe with that as a goal, photographically his perception needs to be catered to beauty. I could be off the mark, but I am impressed by the idea of someone who creates beautiful images to sell in order to help people, but also takes the time in his work to create moments that inspire. As much as this isn’t the latest documentary shot about Scandinavian winter, there is a message in this shot beyond that of the blue sky and pretty horses.

  18. Cliff

    Nice cause…went to the Grand Canyon a few years ago….damn if I didn’t get some good canyon shots.
    Ben…is it the beauty of the place or the vision of the photographer? Is it a record/document or an interpretation? Good point. Peace and love.

  19. panos skoulidas

    Bob Dylan
    once said: “All the tired horses in the sun,
    How am I suppose to ride on one…”
    peace

  21. cathy scholl

    Joining in…Ben and all.

    I really like this image a lot. Glad to see it here. VERY well done.

    I have to agree with Ben that I have hardly ever seen an image that I DIDN’T like from this part of the world. Not than EVERYone can come up with a good composition, know the light, depth of field as well as Michael. As someone who has mostly photographed in India, Burma, Nepal, Bhutan, etc…and have now been exclusively in the US for the past couple years, I have to admit it’s a lot easier (for me at least) to find situations I am excited about photographing in exotic lands and to make good photos there.

    In answer to your question:
    “Should we as photographers travel the well worn path (both in location and in the way we tell stories) or be looking for more original/unique ways of telling stories?”

    I would say that for some photographers it’s a dream come true to find themselves in a situation like Michael was here and to take an image like this one. For others it’s not enough. It is our path to figure out where we fit in and how we want to express ourselves as photographers. Thank goodness there is no right or wrong. It’s all good. It seems that wherever we are most are looking to move away from cliche and be both “a mirror and a window” as David has pointed out so often.

  22. cathy scholl

    p.s.
    I just checked out Michael’s website and now realize he is the student David has been mentoring on the book Blues, Booze & BBQ. I greatly prefer his Asian work over that project but there are undoubtedly many of you who will prefer Blues. Powerhouse Books did evidently! Lucky for Michael he can do both.

  23. alun severn

    Ben clearly has a point — the issue of “beautification”, of presenting the exotic… I don’t know where the dividing line lies — I just know that, yes, I see plenty of photographs that don’t “rise above” or say anything beyond the beauty or the exotic nature of what they depict, and these don’t stay with me.

    But Michael’s picture at least for me doesn’t fall into that category. It takes a superlative moment of human and animal drama, set in a truly memorable context, and raises it to the next level.

    I can’t get closer to it than that, but whether I think in terms of HC-B’s decisive moment, or Sam Abell’s marvellous, “Photographs that transcend but do not deny their literal situation appeal to me”, it does seem a fact that some photographs have it, and some don’t, and this even applies to beautiful photos in beautiful places. Maybe it’s even especially true of beautiful photos in beautiful places…?

    best wishes
    alun

  24. Mike R

    I like it: the galloping white horse makes the photograph. Well captured Michael (good name)!

    Hey Ben, I sometimes feel as if I’m on a DAH / Ben workshop here. Good questions as usual; I’m not sure that this is the place to bring questions such as yours (and sometimes mine) up as they can detract from the subject at hand (enjoying the photograph) and the limitations that a brief comment (we don’t want to hijack the thread).

    I would like to see some sort of discussion board at Burn that would allow debate of such issues separated from the daily posts of photographs. I would also like to read interviews with some of the photographers, particularly those who have an essay published here.

    “Is it enough”, Ben? I take your point entirely. I’m currently struggling to find an essay closer to home and often find myself in a 100 mile round trip to the city just to take photographs. Why go to the city? People – lots of them.

    I think yes, it is enough, at least in the sense that I would hate to lose photographs of exotic locations just because the photographer happened to be a visitor there. In such work there is always the danger of cliche. The visitor does not know the place or subject. His / her understanding is predominantly visual.

    Of course an exotic location is just home to someone else. They may be able to understand the cultural significance of events and bring more understanding to the photographic experience or maybe they will be so used to their surroundings that they will fail to see the photographs in front of them. Like me.

    As to Trent Park’s “Christmas Tree”, I have just had a very brief look at a few photographs at Magnum. I really rate Trent’s work, he photographs in “Dreamtime”.

    I searched for “Christmas Tree” and worked my way through the Magnum Christmas Tree archive until I found a couple of Trent’s photographs. Only two photographs but I can tell you this, I doubt if they will be in his “Life’s Work’ book. Same for the other talented photographers shown at Magnum. I see stock photographs.

    Which brings us back to your question; does the location matter? No … but the subject does. I seem to be living in a period of semi-daylight here where it is cold, everyone is driving around in cars, no one is doing anything and I’m pissed off. I want my sunshine back! This is all your fault Ben.

    I don’t care if a photograph is a cliche just as long as it’s a good – make that very good – photograph.

    Sam Goldwyn, of Metro-Goldwyn-Meyer film studios is famous for his almost-English quotes. He is attributed with saying (something-like) “We don’t have enough cliches in the movies. Bring me some new cliches”!

    Good light to all (there’s not much of it here).

    Mike.

  25. Lassal

    Hi Mike R :)

    The link to Trent Parke’s Essay “The Christmas Tree Bucket” is this here: http://www.magnumphotos.com/Archive/C.aspx?VP=XSpecific_MAG.ExhibitionDetail_VPage&pid=29YL530YT3ML
    You will find more links (also an interview) on “visions for 2009”. Joe put it up for discussion there. Check it out, I think you might find it very interesting.

    And David had planned for us to discuss these topics under “dialogue”, too, he has just not restarted to post his questions there as he used to in “Road Trips”. But the place you were asking for, the “discussion board”, would be right there. :))

    Cheeeeeers

  26. Bob Black

    Ben:

    good question, and a timely one. Though i understand the rationale, as well as the way the ‘exotic’ inhabits us in a way that the everyday seems not to, for photographers to jolt around the globe to pretty locals, I have a severe reservation with it as a practice, generally speaking. A pretty local (or ugly for that matter) does not, not ever, make an arresting photograph. There are for sure pictorial elements that all photographers seem to gravitate toward (shit, we are talking about visual stimulation) and certain content that seem to be re-tread year after year after year (especially by young photographers: sex, drugs, gritty life, poverty, war, famine, friends, babies, sex faces, haunting landscapes, etc ;)) ), but for me what always distinguishes work is the vision (whatever the hell that means) of the photographer. As my beloved Mccarthy wrote in The Crossing, all we have is the Story and all Stories are the same story, always and forever and yet we ring their necks and serve them up to dine upon, because in truth that is all we have: the same stories: the making of who we are in the place around us….

    that said, I for one am not terribly interested in photographs that give me ‘locale’ for the sake of it (that’d be for a travel magazine, or family album) but for photographs that someone strike a cord inside me…this one does…it’s that damn white horse and his/her gallop straight toward me against the barrent, voluminous landscape…at some point, i look toward photos to offer me something besides just the details of the content: some kind of story, be it peculiar of place or universal of heart…whatever…but it is much easier to see, to feel that to express this…

    photographers (especially young and peripatetic) travel as a way to carve their eye…as a way to experience freshness as a way to to see, to re-vitalize…it happens to all of us, ’cause we’re worn, we’re used to the world, the places around us…and it’s an easy and understandable reason why people are drawn to, generally speaking, places like this, faces like that, moments like these…is this enough?…

    as a viewer and a photographer, i prefer Park’s project and have spent my whole life as a photographer trying to carve out my own stories the way i sense and see and remember the world around, not as another did, not as a school taught me, but to feel the way through it…

    one last example: Richards extraordinary The blue Room…in on sense, a book of images that is immemorial (poverty, northern midwest landscape, derelict buildings, death, decay, vanishing lives, etc) and yet, this book is so remarkably Richards…his whole life’s is there, the exhuberance, the death, the sadness, the squalor the hard-won living torn from families and buildings…a remarkable book…and who hasn’t seen that extraordinary empty landscape, the skeletons of departed towns and collapsing buildings scattered like carcas and teeth…and yet, there is not another book like it…richard’s vision made it extraordinary, not just the demise of those towns and the hungried hurried landscape….

    so, i agree and i’d say, each photograher must must concern themselves less with either the well worn path OR telling stories in original/unique ways (that can be a cannard too: look at all the shit in art galleries/art schools), but to tell YOUR STORY in the way YOU CAN/MUST…for that peculiarity, that speech is what then becomes the universal, the most enriching…

    sing the songs you were meant to sing ’cause you have not choice…that’s what i also like in your strongest work: your sense of magic and mystery….that same thing is what alights my life, even though our work is totally different:…

    i think the visual journeys that get validated, at least over time, are the ones that spoke from a place of center, a place that comes from authenticity: the authencity of the person’s experience and life…and that probably has nothing to do with style/form/location ;))))

    excellent question!
    cheers
    bob

  28. david bowen

    paul – you in london next week for a couple of beers?

    sorry – i know this is not facebook.
    okay..
    beautification.. the exotic other and the ease with which a new scene can strike a chord without too much thought.. good chatter..

    something which has always struck me about photography – and perhaps was a reason i was drawn to it over music, writing or any other form of creative expression, is that it can be easier to hide behind a photo..

    what i mean to say is that the visceral link between a nervous musician and his instrument is perceivable to all who listen.. a writers character is given away more easily.

    photographys ambiguity can be used to hide away behind i think..pretty pictures of exotic óthers´ while we carry out our extended holidays to the majority world during a gapo year, believing we are breaking new ground.

    bob is right in saying that photographing our lives and stories makes for the most interesting project.. that´s an opinion of course.. and i agree.

    however, then we have people who do actually spend their lives traveling the globe.. in which case are they not recording the experiences in front of them? the simple fact is that the world is an astonishingly beautiful place – a truth that can be lost when sunken into even the prettiest of cities with more than 1million population.

    a quick flick through michaels website shows that all he is interested in is stories.. and i´m certain the photo here will be from one of the newer ones.. and perhaps again we have the problem of a single photograph not being representational of the photographers overall perception.. it says litle or nothing about his level of ´inner traveling´, but does it really need to, series or not?

    to me the single photo section here is in itself becoming a narrative of sorts, albeit a more random selection than a series from a single author.
    in this context and in the scheme of things, given the last post regarding gaza, i think it´s a fitting follow on .. a rushing break in the overall narrative of this sites single photo entries to propel onto the next photograph.

    and regarding cliche.. good god.. i think photography is about to collapse under the weight of them sometimes.. the cliche that serious photographers snap away at suffering.. that pretty pictures are dull..

  31. david alan harvey

    ALL….

    i will be traveling all day tomorrow….your patience is appreciated since i will not be able to change to a new photograph until tomorrow evening…

    cheers, david

  32. david alan harvey

    LASSAL…

    hmmmmm, yours is a bit of a strange comment for a photograph depicting a “moment”…if the photographer had “waited a split second” as you suggest , what would have happened to the rider in back with the whip with his arm now raised perfectly and his separation just right from the other horses and what would have happened to the shadows in the front and how in the world do you know which way the horses would have gone and what about the amazing fact that it is the white horse only running right at the camera and not one of the others???

    cheers, david

  33. david alan harvey

    SIDNEY…

    i cannot remember when i last used the word “didactic” , but obviously you do…in any case, it probably was in connection with photographs which “explain” or “tell” or “teach” something as opposed to ones which may just give us a “feeling”…was that the context??? if so, then yes this would fall into the category of journalistic photograph that magazine editors would consider “explanatory” or “didactic” or “information driven”…we see geography (sense of place) and we see a cultural activity (sense of being) combined in one photograph….

    cheers, david

  34. david alan harvey

    BEN…

    good question….i see no reason why we cannot explore both..i mean, why not?? surely travel is not an indictment for anyone…travel usually leads to understanding and learning , at least to some degree, about another culture….this could/should lead to reading the history of the area traveled or the best local novels or writers, listening to the local music..just hearing the tales of these horsemen or drinking a cup of coffee with them and getting at least some sense of life different from your own…this would certainly seem to be at least helpful in world full of cultural, political and religious divisions where lack of understanding “other worlds” seems to be one of mankinds main problems…

    at the same time, exploring ones own inner vision of the world in your own “backyard” can be equally enlightening…why would the two be mutually exclusive or one better than the other??? one could say the traveler is someone from the “affluent west” and has no way of really identifying with the subjects he/she photographs, but one could also say the “personal vision” photographer is so self absorbed as to be unable to get outside of his/her own head….

    surely, it depends on the person…how this person processes information..what this person does with the photographs…in what context the photographs are shown/published…it is pretty hard to generalize one way or the other….

    frankly, i usually assume the best of intentions unless i see the worst…

    and while i might see the photographs of Trent to be more personal (they were taken in his home), i am sure Trent would be pleased to be shooting horsemen in Mongolia without apology and i am sure also Mike will show you his family personal pictures and both men would be exploring first one way and then the other with equal aplomb.

    but Ben, you bring up good points….and we should go into it further in other posts…sorry, i cannot go more right now because i must sleep and travel (home!) tomorrow…and i do not think i have been particularly articulate tonight (long long day) …i hope you may at least get my drift!!

    cheers, david

  35. Eric Espinosa

    Michael,

    A very nice moment for sure… This wild white horse creates some magic. This is a region of the world I do not know and wish to travel some day. Would love to have more shots with maybe some portraits of these men!

    Eric

  38. Mike R

    Thanks for the link Lassal. Interesting work but not to my taste I’m afraid. It does capture the “Limbo” of Christmas very well though. Reminds me of the work of Martin Parr: probably the colour palette.

    I really rate Trent’s B&W work.

    Mike.

  41. unevolved neanderthal

    Its a beautiful picture. I could easily live with it on a wall for a while. It is what it is and i see no reason to question the intent of this sort of work, letting the picture itself be self-evident to that.
    An appreciation of black cod in miso does not negate my love of sausage and mash.

  42. Michael Young

    I was working on a personal project, Lands of the Great Budddha. Took a side trip to Mongolia since I had never been there. The cowboys had no problem with me hanging out with them. I just try to stay out of their way.

  43. Jean Ross

    Michael,
    Beautiful – the action, colors, light – this has it all. This is an interesting thread. I often wonder if I fall back on the crutch of the exotic. I haven’t been to Mongolia (yet) but have spent considerable time in Michael’s land of the Buddha – the clear, crisp, high altitude light does provide a real leg up. As does the fact that life is much more out in the world than here in the west.

    I’d love to see this big.

  44. Sidney Atkins

    After David kindly clarified his use of the word ‘didactic’ in relation to photographs, I cannot resist the ‘urge’ to wax didactically on the subject of ‘urga’… for that is the name of that long pole with a lasso-like noose on the end that the horsemen is using in the photograph (can’t really see the noose, but it’s there, I’m sure). Urga was also the name of the Mongolian capital city before the Communist Revolution in 1921 led to a name change (the current official name Ulan Bator or Ulaan Baataar means “Red Hero” but locals sometimes still refer to it as Urga)… and ‘Urga’ was the original name of a great film by Nikita Mikhalkov released in the West as “Close to Eden” in 1992… in which use of the urga figures prominently in not only the livelihood but also the romantic life of Mongols who are still living on the steppes in the traditional way. Didactic enough for one night…

  49. Michael Young

    Mike
    It was a personal project. I just hung out and stayed out of their way until they were cool with me shooting. I returned after the first day with photos for them.

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